Ep 490: What It Takes to Overcome an Autoimmune Condition With Autumn McLees

Can taking control of your diet, lifestyle and your thought process really help you overcome an autoimmune condition?  Because a condition is considered uncurable – is it really?  Autumn Mclees is a coach, doula, mentor and host of the Know Better Do Better podcast for women seeking alternative methods to overcome their health conditions. Through her own experience of overcoming vaginal lichen sclerosis and now hepatitis C Autumn is passionate about raising awareness and empowering individuals to explore holistic and alternative medicine approaches to health care. In this episode Dr. Jannine Krause interviews Autumn McLees on what it takes to pioneer your own health treatment, the alternative therapies she’s tried and what’s worked for lichen sclerosis as well as hepatitis C.

Resources From The Show:

• Autumn’s Podcast: Know better do better Podcast
• autumnmclees.com
• IG and TikTok -@autumn.mclees
• Facebook
• Autumn’s “Know Better Do Better” Consulting mentorship
• Autumn’s Clean Swap Guide 

Our Partners

Podcast Transcript

3:04 – Autumn’s backstory / The awakening

8:31 – The diagnosis

14:10 – The Changes Autumn made in her life to heal

17:55 – Natural treatments

26:04 – Therapies Autumn has tried

29:11 – Bowen therapy

38:06 – Being a Doula

44:55 – You don’t have to be a victim

47:21 – Rewiring your brain for a healthier life

52:31 – Exercise for rewiring your brain

55:00 – About Autumn’s podcast and where to find her online

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[Intro] Welcome to The Health Fix Podcast, where health junkies get their weekly

fix of tips, tools, and techniques to have limitless energy, sharp minds, and fit

physiques for life.

Hey Health Junkies, on this episode of the Health Fix Podcast, I’m interviewing Autumn

McLees. She’s a coach, a doula, a mentor, and host of the No Better, Do Better Podcast.

Autumn is all about empowering folks

to explore alternative healthcare options.

And really through her own experience

of overcoming vaginal lichen sclerosis

and now she’s working on Hepatitis C,

Autumn’s really learning what it takes

to empower your own body to heal itself.

So we go into some really fascinating topics

and different kinds of treatments

that maybe you haven’t even heard of before.

So if you’re struggling with an autoimmune condition,

like autumn, and you’re just feeling hopeless,

this podcast is for you.

Because we’re gonna talk about all kinds of different options

that you might not be thinking about,

including using your own mind to help you to heal yourself.

While it sounds a little woo, trust me,

I’ve seen some good stuff.

So is Autumn.

She’s proof of it.

I have plenty of patience who are as well.

So let’s introduce you to Autumn McLeese

and the concept that you have it in you

to take care of yourself and your health conditions.

All right, let’s get on with the podcast.

JANNINE: Autumn McLees, welcome to The Health Fix podcast.

AUTUMN: I am so honored to be here

with your incredible listeners.

Thank you for the honor.

JANNINE: Oh, it’s my pleasure.

You know, we were talking before hit record.

And one of the biggest things that I really want to send

a message about and you are on point with this is that

we have the power to heal ourselves.

We don’t have to give our power to someone else.

And we are definitely going to dive into that today.

So high five on taking the power back

and putting it back in more hands.

AUTUMN: Yeah, that’s truly what my story and journey encompasses

from a scenario years ago to a current one right now

that I am overcoming.

JANNINE: Well, we’re definitely gonna talk about that today.

So let’s start with, you know, a lot of people,

I’ve had so many more patients diagnosed

with autoimmune conditions as it is on the rise

and you know, there can be lots of other argued statements

as to why it may also be on the rise, but nevertheless,

like in sclerosis, vaginally.

Holy cow, you healed yourself of this.

This is a big deal.

And I think for a lot of people,

they might be like, “lichen, what is this?”

So let’s give them the scoop.

Let’s talk about how it becomes an autoimmune condition

or how it is an autoimmune condition

and what kind of impacts it has on you.

AUTUMN: Yeah, so as I understand it, it’s an autoimmune condition

and you can probably enlighten more on this,

but the basics of it is that it attacks the skin.

And for women, it can attack in different places.

For me, it was a vaginal condition.

And we actually thought it was like a yeast infection at first.

You know, it had kind of some of those symptoms

until I went into the gynecologist and he’s like,

oh, we gotta do a punch biopsy.

I’m suspicious of lichen sclerosis.

So sure enough came back and that’s what he said.

And it, I guess, wasn’t too much of a surprise

because my mom actually had it years prior.

And so when I found myself with it,

obviously at this time in my life,

I knew nothing about health.

I was just like the average American living off of,

you know, fast food and buying regular groceries

at the grocery store and just not aware

that my diet played such a role in my body

and my health condition.

And that’s part of my story is literally by changing my diet.

I was able to reverse this.

So you let me know if you want me to just roll right into it

or if you have any other questions before me.

JANNINE: Now roll into it, roll into it.

This is good stuff.

AUTUMN: Yeah, so well, let me take it back here for a minute

just so we have a little bit more context of who I was.

So like I said, just average American,

living life and, am I awakening actually?

‘Cause this precedes the whole like,

and sclerosis thing ’cause I wouldn’t have known

what I knew at the time.

So this is like my pivotal moment.

It was before I had any kids

and I was, must have been just at home kind of doing laundry

and I had the TV on and this infomercial comes on.

And I don’t normally watch infomercials

but I kind of found myself there,

gazing and listening to what he was saying.

And he was talking about a book called “Natural Cures

They Don’t Want You To Know About.”

And it got my attention and I ended up buying the book,

which I don’t think I’ve ever bought anything

from an infomercial.

So I get at home and I read through that thing so fast.

And I’m not even a reader either.

And I found myself really just taken

and convicted by this truth that really made sense to me.

That, ’cause it doesn’t make sense,

are we really meant to feel this way?

Were we really meant to walk around

and live in such a sick culture?

Is there really no answers or solutions

to what everybody’s struggling with?

I mean, is this it?

And so what he was sharing was all this awareness

that woke me up to ingredients that’s in our foods.

And basically I came to the realization of,

my gosh, I’m a sheep to the slaughterhouse.

Like if I don’t wake up to what they’re putting in our food

and be aware and be a good steward of this body

that God gave me, then I’ve got to just accept

what the consequences are.

way they take charge or essentially I kind of allow myself to become a victim of whatever

they’re doing because they don’t have plans to keep us healthy. The food industry doesn’t,

they’re just there to make money. So I woke up and the first thing I did in reading some of this

is I learned about MSG and how it’s a neurotoxin and it over over excites ourselves to the point of

death. And so it’s hidden under like 30 different names. I went in the kitchen, I went through some

of my boxed foods. And sure enough, I found many boxes that had MSG hidden, you know,

two to five times that I was eating and I had no idea. So then I found myself going to our local

Trader Joe’s, which is so funny because I’d never been there. And I just thought, I didn’t

know what it was. I just, you know, went to a regular grocery store. And when I went into

Trader Joe’s for the first time, I remember going over to the deli section and I picked

up some of their meat and I was learning to kind of read labels and look for things

that I had learned in this book, you know, to be aware of. And the meat said no nitrates and I’m

like, what’s nitrates? Like what in the world? Like I, at that time, you know, 14 years ago or

whatever it was, there wasn’t as much packaging that stated like in the regular grocery store,

or no GMOs, no this, no that.

So the fact that it was saying boldly, no nitrates,

I was like, wow, well, what’s this?

So anyway, lo and behold,

that was the pivotal moment of my awakening,

of me really waking up to, okay,

like we have a problem here and we all need to be aware of it.

And some people are aware of it,

but they don’t maybe believe it enough,

or they don’t realize how much food controls us.

So now we, now I find myself with this diagnosis

years later.

I would slowly but surely trying to do better buying organic,

making healthier choices, very much a process.

And when I got this diagnosis, my doctor said,

well, we don’t know why you have it.

We, there’s nothing you can do other than take a medication

and the medication side effects is that it was going

to essentially worsen my condition.

So for me, having like in sclerosis vaginally,

that looked like little fissure tears during intercourse

with my husband who I’d been married to

for like seven years at the time.

So that was like a whole new, like what in the world’s

going on.

And I eventually wanted to have another baby.

So at the time of diagnosis, I had had a C-section prior,

and I wanted to go on to have a vaginal birth.

Well, I knew that there was not going to be any chance

of a vaginal birth if I couldn’t even tolerate, you know,

just daily stuff with your husband, right?

So the doctor gave me no hope, no hope, no answers.

And just left me frustrated, really.

said nothing about diet and just, yeah, really just left me high and dry.

Thankfully, in my process of waking up to all that food stuff, I had found a holistic

practitioner, functional medicine doctor, in our neighboring city at a health food store.

And I thought, huh, I wonder if she can help me. And so I called up the office.

she actually called me back.

I told her what I was struggling with.

And I said, do you think you can help me?

I wanna go on to have a vaginal birth

and plus this is like no way to live.

She said, yeah, I really think that I can help you.

So I, that’s not covered by insurance.

So I have financially, you know,

had to make a commitment to this,

which is another uncomfortable thing, right?

Like our insurance pays for mainstream medicine

but we can’t always get answers or solutions.

In fact, like I feel like rarely can we ever get

an actual resolution of our condition over there.

So our option is either live with it

or take a med to band-aid the problem

and the med that band-aids the problem

could likely lead to other side effects

which then require other medications.

But that’s okay because your insurance covers all this, right?

So it’s just like you either go down that path

or you go down the path of, you know,

you have to put on your big girl panties

and it’s gonna be on you,

the instruction of a naturopath like yourself

or a functional medicine doctor

or whatever holistic practitioner,

they’re gonna tell you what to do

and it’s up to you to do it in the day in

and the day out of what they suggest

and what healing measures and protocols

are going to set you up so that your body is put in a place where it can heal.

So essentially, we’re working on removing the interference that is keeping it from healing

and living as healthy and functioning optimally.

And so I saw her.

She found autoimmunity levels like high ANA.

I mean, it was really surprising

that I didn’t have more health issues going on

than what I did ’cause they were pretty high,

pretty significant.

And so basically long story short,

in four months of completely changing my diet

and getting really strict and refined,

getting on some supplements that,

according to my blood work showed

that I needed some support in some areas.

I, well, let me just say this, in one month,

I stopped tearing, which blew my freaking mind

that what I put in my mouth literally correlated

with down self, like who would have ever thought?

And then in four months, we watched my blood work

basically return to normal.

She gave me the thumbs up to get pregnant.

I did and we had the most incredible V-back home birth in my home and I didn’t even tear.

And that my friends is the power of the body and how it can heal with the right resources

and the right guidance.

JANNINE: So huge, so huge.

I think the one thing is, is going from lichen sclerosis,

guys, I will describe what I’ve seen.

I mean, it looks like dehydrated beef jerky skin,

like for lack of a better term.

And so to the other not.

AUTUMN: Yeah, that’s probably the, yeah, the more worse end of it.

I mean, and I can’t even imagine what that is,

’cause I was struggling with just,

I don’t think mine was as severe,

but I mean, it was miserable, so I can’t even imagine.

Yeah.

JANNINE: I’ve seen, I’ve seen some terrible cases, um, vaginal, labia.

I mean, it just, wow.

Um, so what I know a lot of folks are going to be like, okay.

So what was, what was deficient?

What, what did you have that was deficient and what dietary changes?

Like what was your whole overhaul?

Did you go completely organic and start growing your own food?

Like how, how far did you go?

What did you do?

AUTUMN: Yeah, so I felt like my now looking back the changes that I did make, which I will say in just a second, that my body was just so receptive to finding some relief.

It was like looking for something to just grasp onto to get an upper hand, because if I could give it just a chance to get that upper hand.

It’s like it just gained momentum.

And I mean, four months just seems like, wow, that’s fast.

And it really it really seems fast and for some people their healing is is rather fast in fact

I played a role right now in my hut my friend’s husband who

Has cirrhosis and he’s been on the meldscore chart

He is now he was like a 20 the chart is like a 6 to a 40

Total side note, but I just have to throw this in because it’s so exciting and it’s happening right now

So you started a six and he was at a 20

He is down to an eight and this is all through

Changing his diet and his lifestyle and the body is healing. So back to me. I was I did as much organic as I could

At the time I was like caregiving for my grandma so I had to take her out to dinner

There was reasons why I didn’t take her out to dinner, but so I wasn’t always able to eat organic

but I would get what I could.

So no, I wasn’t 100% organic,

but I was gluten-free and dairy-free for those months.

And then vitamin D, magnesium, a really good multivitamin,

just some pretty basic stuff.

I think there was some other extra things

that she threw in for gut health.

Oh, I did do kind of like a Candida protocol for a couple of weeks because she, she seemed

to believe that there was some Candida present.

And for those that don’t know, that is basically an overgrowth of yeast in the vaginal canal.

And so we wanted to kind of starve some of that off.

So obviously no sugar.

So yeah, but I mean, was it worth it?

Oh my gosh.

Heck yeah.

fortunate that all the other women before me and behind me that are still living with

lichen sclerosis, that they don’t, they weren’t, they’re not able to, because they don’t know

the possibility of being able to completely reverse it.

JANNINE: That is why we’re talking today.

You better believe that all my tag words and all the SEO in this are going to be blowing

that out there because it is, I mean, it’s a tough, it’s a tough autoimmune condition.

I’ve described, I’ve seen some pretty severe cases.

And gosh, like in planas, there are various differentiations here on this.

And it is tough.

But yes, I have seen very powerful things happen with very basic things, not complicated

protocols.

Yes, you do have to put the work in, but here we are.

Tell us a little bit about your most recent experience.

Now you’ve got some some hepatitis C that you’re working on treating naturally.

Give us the scoop.

Give us the background.

AUTUMN: Oh, man.

Okay.

So this one is really like just a phenomenon.

Let me just say because most people for those that don’t know hepatitis C is just

like supposed to be a bloodborne condition.

So you get it through oftentimes shooting up drugs,

which I’ve never done a drug in my life,

blood transfusions, what else?

Like some say intercourse,

but my husband and I,

we’ve only been with each other.

He doesn’t have it.

It’s just totally what a tattoos,

I don’t have a tattoo.

So it is something that supposedly affects

up to 50 million people in our nation and it affects the liver.

And so ultimately people can end up getting cirrhosis and/or liver cancer,

and that’s how they may pass based on hepatitis C.

But so almost three years ago,

I got this mysterious diagnosis and clearly you can see why I say mysterious.

I was just getting routine blood work and that same holistic doctor that helped me with

my, like in sclerosis, she was like, “Hodom, what is the matter with your liver?”

And I’m like, “I don’t know.

What are you talking about?”

And she said, “I can’t believe you’re not jaundiced right now.

Like I’ve got to check you for different types of hepatitis.”

So she did and it came back positive for Hep C and I said, “There’s no way.

like you have to redo that they mixed up the labs.

Like there’s no way I can’t even have that.

So now, since I’ve been on this journey,

I have had three different gastroenterologists

say that I likely picked it up from a nail salon.

But then I’ve also had, ’cause I have my podcast

and we’ve talked about German viral theory.

I don’t know if you’ve ever gone there,

but I’ve had some practitioners say,

there is no proof, there is no proof

for a hepatitis C virus.

Now, obviously that’s a whole nother rabbit hole,

so we won’t go there.

But point is, I am here,

I do have liver inflammation.

Now, the last couple months,

it’s actually been on the lower side,

And I’ve been doing all sorts of things to work on naturally combating this and ultimately conquering it.

I really do believe that I will get there and, you know, we’ll line up the podcast tour at that point

because I want to share with the world what is possible.

But in the process, yeah, I have chosen to put the medication on the back burner.

It is not something and really it’s got a black box warning.

It has a ton of risks inside effects.

And the very organ that is quote compromised right now is the organ that is going to have

to, you know, process this medication.

And so my liver has been been good overall.

And I don’t see any point in in going there right now.

There might be a time and a place for that, but I have learned so much in this journey

and it has been so such an incredible.

It sounds crazy to say it’s been a gift, but it I’ve started my podcast from it.

I’ve learned so much.

I know my story is going to be meant to help bring some sort of new awareness or encourage

or inspire someone.

It can’t just go to waste.

So I am here to share and talk about it in that way.

JANNINE: You know, it’s not uncommon for me to also have seen folks with hepatitis C that we have

no idea why it’s showing up.

There’s a test called an array 12, which is an immune marker test.

It shows like what chronic like autoimmune marker, not autoimmune.

Sorry.

What antibodies we have chronically in the blood and sometimes I will pick it up there

without testing hepatitis C, even though let’s put it this way, a lot of it’s a mimic hepatitis

C antibody.

And so it’s very interesting, this connection between that.

AUTUMN: Really?

JANNINE: Yes.

AUTUMN: Huh.

JANNINE: Yes, yeah.

AUTUMN: I’ll have to check that out.

JANNINE: Yeah, I’ll connect you with the array 12 information

’cause it’s something that it’s just the mimic heptide

or something like that.

I will get it guys for you correctly here.

But it is, it’s interesting because I’ve had a couple

of people composite it for that on higher levels

and we talk about hepsy, we then of course go back

and run their viral loads and see if anything’s going on

we look at their, you know, platelets and all that.

And like, interestingly enough, I would say that I had a dozen

or more people that were like, no idea, no idea where the shows

up and why, where it’s coming in.

And then this is the point at which, of course, send them

to my good friend who does EBU and IV therapy and things of that nature.

So I would love for you to talk about those therapies that you’ve tried

and the different things that you’re doing for the liver at this point.

So folks can kind of hear a little bit about things because, you know, in my practice,

it’s not my specialty.

So I hand off to, to a doc that is a pal of mine to, to take care of these things.

So yeah, let’s talk about it a little bit.

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AUTUMN: Yeah, so there is a lot of interesting,

incredible therapies out there.

And I’m kind of in a place where,

you know, I just to make this said and known

because my situation is a bit more unique.

So if you have your listening and you’re

someone that’s struggling with something

that is more common or that has like a name

that’s commonly dealt with in the holistic realm,

they’re likely gonna have a more assured response of,

you need this or you need that.

In my case, pretty much all the practitioners

that I’m working with,

they’ve never encountered someone

that’s wanting to take on Hepatitis C naturally,

and they’re for me,

but they don’t necessarily know what’s gonna do it

or what’s gonna help.

So I’ve been working with these different practitioners

to try and find what is going to put a dent in this.

And so in the process of whether it has

or hasn’t put a dent in my current situation,

which all of these has done a little something, I would say,

but for particular circumstances

for maybe some of you listening,

I mean, they can really send it home

for certain conditions.

These can be like a total game changer.

So let me just like rattle off some and if any, you know,

stick out, I guess we could go more into it.

So I’ve had vitamin CIBs,

hydrogen peroxide IVs, which I didn’t even know

you could put hydrogen peroxide in the blood,

but you can, it’s an antiviral, obviously, you know,

an antibacterial.

I’ve also had something called UVBI,

which essentially is UV light therapy

where they send your blood through UV light

and it’s supposed to destroy any pathogens

or parasites or viruses and things.

Then it goes into a bag, they ozenate it or oxygenate it

and then they send it back through the UV light

and back into you.

I’ve also had some treatments with like biomats,

lasers,

Liver cleanses obviously like with supplemental form.

I’ve had the Rife machine,

which is a electrical frequency that you hang on to.

And ’cause it’s said that there’s a frequency,

excuse me, it says that there’s a frequency out there

that can destroy any pathogen.

like you just have to find the right frequency.

Just like the right frequency can shatter glass.

Well, you can find the right frequency

that will essentially destroy hepatitis C.

So that’s the right machine.

I’ve had like this Vegas nerve treatment,

Bowen therapy.

Oh my gosh.

Bowen therapy is absolutely incredible.

Have you ever heard of it?

JANNINE: I have heard of it.

I’ve never experienced it myself,

though. Tell folks about it. 

AUTUMN: Oh my gosh. So definitely look up a

bow and therapist near you. There’s not very many of them. So

hopefully through our podcast and getting the word out, we can

help people get more in this, but it’s an Australian modality.

And basically, it works with the fascia. So it is like a small

manipulation on the top of the skin and they do it in very particular places on the body

and the manipulation that they do sends a signal because the fascia sends signals

to the brain and it you know that’s how our body like kind of talks to each other in the

different parts in the organs etc. And so it can send signals to certain parts that

um, essentially ignite like healing functions, maybe in a joint or an organ or relaxing certain

muscles. I mean, I sent a friend that was having, um, sciatica and within her first treatment,

it was gone. And it’s almost laughable because they don’t look like they’re even doing anything.

It’s, it’s, I guess kind of similar, the closest thing I could say is like maybe some,

some are similar to acupuncture, but it’s different points. Some of the acupuncture points correlate

and others are just all just in the bow and world of its own uniqueness. So anyway, that was,

that was incredible. That greatly changed my blood work. It was rather mind blowing.

JANNINE: Whoa, I didn’t have to change it. I’m sorry. I got to know.

AUTUMN: Yeah, good question. So okay, this is what I was told. I was told if you’re gonna do Bowen,

you do three times and

See like what it does for you. You have to do at least three times because that’s like this kind of

For lack of a better term like magical window to really see what it can do.

So I did it and on the third time

I had just worked out perfectly. I had just gotten blood work like two weeks prior and then I was

getting it again for some reason and I got it like two days after and I’m not even joking.

My liver enzymes were completely normal and my viral load was like so close to being normal.

I couldn’t even believe it. And the unfortunate thing, oh my gosh, is I was like so excited.

Well then I went away and visited a friend and we ended up talking about parasite cleanses and I

came home and I got on a parasite cleanse and it shot everything back up again, everything.

And so, and then after that, like I did some more Bowen and it’s incredibly relaxing to

the nervous system.

It really calms the nervous system.

So but it hasn’t quite had that same effect again as what it did on the third treatment.

Now, I know people with like, I know of people with like Parkinson’s that like one guy sees

a friend of mine that does Bowen.

And he comes to her multiple times a month

because it actually helps him be able to walk

and function and move his body.

So for my case, in my viral condition,

I don’t know what that was,

but I know that for so many other people

it’s an incredible modality.

And so that’s Bowen therapy.

I also ventured into trying Ivermectin.

And then I also have done some microcurrent therapies,

which is microcurrent frequencies directly on my liver.

And then something called Therafy,

which is like using a Tesla coil.

And it has these noble gases at the head,

you land a table and it’s at the right next to your head

and then right next to your feet.

And essentially it sends us like electrifying,

ionizing frequency through your body

where it raises the levels of the lower,

sicker, more stagnant points of the body.

And that was doing that in the microcurrent

’cause that was at the same facility.

That was doing amazing things for quite a while too for me.

So yeah, and then I’m currently doing some light wave patches

and then I just got done with a 21-day

liver regeneration, beet juicing protocol.

So I’m doing all the things over here.

I will be back at some point, Jannine,

to tell you that I have arrived,

but right now we’re still on the journey.

JANNINE: Hey, you know what though?

I mean, you’ve tried a lot of things

and definitely, you know, let’s put it this way.

You’re not alone in trying all the things.

And I think that’s a good thing for folks to hear that,

like, yes, unfortunately we do have to test out

some things and try things just to know

what’s gonna work best for us.

And oddly enough, I have seen the Bowen work like that too, helping folks reduce antibodies,

reverse, reduce liver enzymes. I mean, crazy stuff, helping, you know, like boost adrenal,

like if we’re looking at cortisol or even like sodium, potassium, chloride, like the electrolytes,

I’ve seen that change in and even blood sugar markers change. And so there’s something with

with a fascia, I’m very convinced that fascia has a lot to do with trapping things.

And so, one of the things I’ll just say, just to throw in as a thought process, because

I have a lot of theories about gallbladder disease and liver disease and the fascia getting

trapped in that area.

And I have seen over and over again, folks, they’re, you know, maybe they noticed that

They’ve got a little bit gallbladder stuff or things happen like that.

And then they’ll take either a cleanse protocol, like a parasite or they’ll do like a liver

cleanse and their liver enzyme shoot to the roof.

And then they’re mad at me because they’re like, why did you do the damage?

My liver?

I’m like, hold on, hold on.

Stop what you’re doing.

Let’s let’s do a little bit of facial work.

Let’s do a little self-fashion work.

It goes right down.

So, you know, you could say, yes, they stopped all the things and it did better, but

their their enzymes were higher before, you know, elevated and then they went higher and then they went down below.

So just so you guys who are listening going, well, anything could stop it. Well, it was a little bit better than the level that we first started.

So anyway, I love facial stuff, Bowen. Yes, I’ve never experienced it myself, but I’ve done other kinds of things.

So– 

AUTUMN: you showed it’s amazing. It’s so relaxing.

JANNINE: Big plug for that. And then you would mention, you know, the there’s a product called like the amp coil,

which is very similar to what you were describing in terms of the electrical frequencies.

I believe that there is something to these frequencies.

And I and like you had said that each each bug has its own frequency and there’s

a frequency at which we can knock these things out.

And and I do.

I’m, you know, the more I’ve been in the game, the more I’m like, there’s something

to that too.

But I do sound like a quack because I’m like, well, you could try this or you could

try.

Yeah.

Because here we are in a realm that we’re trying to figure these things out, folks.

It’s not, you know, we don’t have a set pattern and which brings me to where I know that you feel like I do in terms of

The power of bringing the health back to yourself, but also really looking at a holistic women’s health type of

Approach versus

Having to go down the modern medicine route that you know if it’s not serving you like obviously

I’m not gonna say that

you know, being able to have a C-section, an emergency situation is, you know, don’t do it, it’s trouble.

No, there are benefits for modern medicine advances, but there are times when the holistic part of things might be the better option.

So you have a history of being a doula and you have some interesting experiences you’re talking about with the whole birth process as well.

So give us a little background on what you’ve seen be amazing with the holistic side of birth and

Training for birth and preparing for birth and the process

AUTUMN: Yeah, so what

What I’ve really seen and now have come to learn is

There was a reason

Why

God set it up for us to birth naturally and not have as many C-sections as what are being performed today

Unfortunately, you know

the worst of it is because the doctor is going on a vacation and

It’s just easier to get the mom in and that is just horrific in my mind and it might take a while for

You know women’s minds to come over to see that side of things

but now that I’ve lived in it and I’ve been a birth doula for 12 years, I’ve seen how the

conventional world works and it’s not, I think there’s some sort of knowledge there that it’s

not always in the best interest of the mom and baby as far as letting things just flow naturally.

But yeah, so basically, let me just break it down.

So I’ve mostly performed in the hospital setting,

supporting women through what they usually want,

which is a natural childbirth,

or as natural as we can get,

because that can be challenging in the hospital.

I have done also many home births with midwives.

And so, you know, I had the perception long ago

that, oh, a home birth is like incredibly risky and scary.

I mean, you’re risking your life,

you’re risking your baby’s life.

And I came to find out that’s actually not true

for a healthy pregnant woman with no pregnancy complications.

It’s actually just as safe, very close in numbers

as the hospital is birthing in the hospital.

And so, like for example, my midwife that I birthed with,

I called her like the queen bee of Southern California.

My daughter was her 880th home birth.

And she went on to have, I think close to like 1500,

I don’t remember where she left off,

but she went on Will past mine before she retired.

She never, ever had a baby or a mom die.

So it’s not, it’s a bit of a foggy facade

that we peer into that world

and we think that it’s dangerous.

So with that said,

I’ve watched the natural processes of labor unfold

and women can have, I won’t say always,

but can have more of a kind of an enriched experience

because, and I will say, because it’s less interrupted

and there’s less interventions

with the natural hormones that are taking place,

especially when maybe he’s born,

you have a surge of all these incredible bonding,

oxytocin, you know, hormones that come into the picture.

And so that is often, there’s interference,

there’s disruption in that process in the hospital

because oftentimes we’ve maybe got medication

or just the labor hormones in general, the bright lights

and the demands and sometimes the fear that comes in,

you know, it just not as respected as what it is.

And so it, yeah.

So with that said, the health benefits

of delivering naturally, I mean,

from the baby getting its guts seeded properly

when baby comes down the birth canal,

their little gut is sterile.

And it’s mom’s amniotic fluid that gets to seed

and essentially start off that baby’s immune system.

in Europe, they’ve recognized this,

that they’ve swabbed the noses and the mouths

of C-section babies, and all that they’re finding

is bad pathogens and the bad negative bacteria.

There’s no good guys.

And so they’re now taking the amniotic fluid

and bathing baby in it to help the seeding process

for the baby’s gut.

And it’s so surprising, my son, he wound up

with a yeast infection just weeks after

I delivered him and thankfully I was just barely learning enough to notice

starting on a little infant probiotic to support his gut.

So tons of benefits there and physically for mom and the hormones and the

postpartum phase when you just leave things, you know,

more untouched and just let nature take its course.

Birth is not a procedure.

It is a natural function of the body.

And I think we get way too caught up in once again.

We’re just disempowered when it comes to our birthing processes, just like our health.

And we need to be reminded of that.

And then on the flip side of, okay, you’ve had your baby, maybe you’re older now, you’re

getting those well-woman visits.

Seeing a midwife is just the most beautiful, respectful appointment that you can have for

getting a pap smear or a breast exam. I really feel like there’s so much extra wisdom and just

beauty and tender and care and respect in that midwife for the woman that she is overseeing.

I mean a pap smear is just like a night and day experience between a gynecologist and midwife.

I mean, need I say more.

It’s just, it’s so much better and more comfortable too.

JANNINE: Yeah.

No, I highly recommend seeing nurse midwives,

nurse practitioners as well.

You know, it’s a different,

it definitely is a different experience.

I have a couple of really favorite nurse midwives

that I know in town where I practice.

And really it’s one of those things

that we need to think about a little bit, you know.

AUTUMN: But we’re here, we’re here to empower others to stand up

and step into the awareness that,

if they don’t like who they’re seeing,

go find somebody else.

You are not a victim, the victim mentality will defeat you.

And if you believe that there’s nothing you can do,

back to just health for a minute,

or excuse me, if you believe there’s nothing you did

to contribute to your problems and there’s nothing you can do

to help yourself outside of take a drug or show up

to a doctor’s appointment, then you really are a victim.

You know, and that’s the cycle that you’re gonna live in

but you can choose to take control of your life

and your health and you can say,

I’m not gonna be a victim.

And you know, and part of that might be like what I had

to look at and realize, I mean,

going back to my Hep C really fast,

I mean, my body, okay, what was I,

my body didn’t have to assume

or come down with the virus.

Like just because I was exposed

doesn’t mean that I had to assume it and fully get it.

But I did.

So I had to look at, okay, like,

what was I not doing well in life?

And looking back, I was working way too much.

I was sitting all the time, I wasn’t moving,

I wasn’t exercising.

I mean, I was eating clean,

but my stress and my lifestyle was like,

no wonder I’m like not even getting good oxygen

and your body needs good oxygenation to fight off disease.

So it’s been an awakening process

that like I said has been a blessing,

but we have to be courageous enough to be able to look it

and see what we could have done better.

And then rise up out of that,

we can become a victim or a victor.

JANNINE: That’s wise advice.

It’s wise advice and it’s absolutely 100%.

It’s 100%.

I, if anyone is, that’s listening right now

is wondering about their health,

how to move forward with it.

We do have to take responsibility.

We do. We have to take some responsibility for, for why things went in one direction or the other and not keep looking for all the external reasons, which brings me to the one thing that we haven’t talked about yet is the concept of brain rewiring as it’s related to health and how that plays into everything since I noticed that you had mentioned you’ve been working on that too.

AUTUMN: This realm of the brain nervous system rewiring is really fascinating.

And I wasn’t so sure of it at first, I will say.

But once I understood it, I’m like, okay, this makes sense.

And then hearing the stories of what this has done for people, also people

with uncurable conditions, even HIV in this, this realm of, of holistic

approaches through this nervous system brain rewiring.

People have overcome. And so my my coach, she was down to just being able to eat.

I think she said like seven or eight foods. She was sensitive to everything.

She had major gut issues, major anxieties. And once she dealt with her nervous system, so she

did all these costly protocols, all these holistic options and paths, which she will say,

and she will guide the person into, we still need to eat healthy. You still need to do some of that,

and you might still need some support in the supplement realm. But she now lives in this whole

paradigm that and it’s true. If the nervous system is not calm, if you’re not in rest and digest

more than in the overdrive and the fight or flight, then your body simply never has any window of

time to be able to heal. Now, the reason why you might tend to live in fight or flight

more than rest and digest is because of possibly things that go even as far back to your childhood

and how you respond to things in the world or how some of your, and it could be childhood,

It could be something that happened last week.

I mean, it could be any time in life,

but it’s for you to identify.

Was there something that took place

that created a trauma, an upset,

where it causes your body to get in this place

of a fearful response?

I mean, some people might even live in this just from COVID.

They might be like set in this new nervous system response.

I’m just constantly worrying and fear

and overthinking things that, you know,

they might have, they might need to really sit

with themselves and think, did I really, you know,

go backwards during that and work on overcoming that.

Anyway, she teaches, we work on going back

to different things and scenarios or moments or whatever.

And then she has these exercises that we do

that’s like an oral exercise

and with some like affirmations.

And you’re really just catching yourself

in the midst of your day.

If you find yourself a little anxious

or if you find yourself not calm,

I’m just like maybe thinking a lot of things

and I’m just realizing like,

Wow, I’m kind of like overstimulated right now.

Let’s calm down.

I do these exercises.

I say these affirmations

and it’s a slow and gradual process

that you work with yourself

to create new neuro pathways in the brain

that teach your body to stay calm more often

and to not be so hyper-vigilant in your response.

And some of these things might even be

on a subconscious level,

but at least the conscious ones you deal with first.

And then she helps bring more and more out

in the subconscious as well.

JANNINE: That’s a great explanation of brain rewiring

and taking it full circle for us.

It’s good stuff.

I’m in the process of learning it myself.

And I think it’s something that really,

I work with a lot of clients on it now,

even though I’m still learning it myself,

I feel like it’s just a matter of all of us needing

to learn how to find calm and peace

in the chaos that we have in our world

and our inner thoughts and all of that.

AUTUMN: And just to leave the audience with some exercises

that anyone can do, it really just boils down to

stopping, like whatever you’re feeling in that moment of fear, anger,

you know, anxiousness. And you go through your three senses, you look and you focus on

something like maybe there’s a bird in the tree. And then you think of like three sounds that you

can hear and you just like look for those sounds and you can say them out loud. I hear the refrigerator

humming. I hear a bird. I hear a car going by. And then like two things that you might smell.

And just that alone.

And then the affirmations are I am safe

because when your body is in an over

like hypervigilant response, I think she calls it,

it thinks it’s being chased by a bear.

It doesn’t know the difference.

Like your body is responding in that way.

And if you don’t work on pulling back

and stopping that response,

It’s like it just gets driven in to become

a more normalized response.

And before you know it, you’re living that all the time.

And so when you can learn to have more control

to calm yourself and be more mindful of when you’re not

at peace and then do things to intentionally get yourself

to that more peaceful place, that’s the self-empowering part

this is you have so much you can do to kind of undo and reverse some of these autopilot tendencies

that keep you from healing and can promote and propel you into the future where your body is in

more of a rest and digest healing state. 

JANNINE: So huge, so huge that we can do this. I’m like, why wasn’t

isn’t this taught in preschool for us really?

Like what the heck?

But here we are learning it now.

Autumn, my goodness,

we have talked about so many different things

and gosh, so much cool stuff here.

I would love for folks to know about your podcast

a little bit better or a little bit more,

know better, do better.

A lot of better stuck in my head here.

AUTUMN: Yes, yes.

JANNINE: So tell us about your podcast,

what folks can expect from that.

Tell us where we can find you online

and all of that good stuff.

AUTUMN: Absolutely.

Well, I know better do better podcasts.

We cover all things alternative holistic paths to wellness.

So I mean, I cover anything from healthy brands.

I love to have on like healthy food brands

that do it right and actually care about our health,

to holistic practitioners, to holistic dentists.

That’s a whole nother realm.

JANNINE: Yeah.

AUTUMN: And I got a dentist for you to have on

that’ll blow your mind.

Like so many breast cancers can actually be linked back

to root canals, are you familiar with that?

JANNINE: Yep.

AUTUMN: Yeah.

So that’s a whole ‘nother can of worms to open up

but so important that you see a dentist

that is conservative and they’re not like literally looking

to drill and bill you for every little thing in your mouth.

And we even have an episode on straighten your teeth naturally, which is this incredible

thing called myobrace and myofunctional therapy.

I’m sure you’re familiar with that.

But anyway, so we have a blast over there.

And then website is autumnmclees.com and Instagram and TikTok is autumn.mclees.

And then I also have a consulting mentorship program where I essentially help guide people

that are struggling, whether they’re wanting to, you know, do the basics of, okay, I want to start

to like overhaul parts of my kitchen and my pantries. I want to do better with the foods that I’m

buying. And I want to know about those clean brands or the clean laundry detergent or the clean dish

washing stuff. So I actually have a free before this, I can get you the link so you can pass along

to the listeners, but there is a clean swap guide that I have that covers everything from

ketchup to water filters to makeup and even a candle that fights mold in your home, which is

incredible. And but yeah, then back to the mentorship consulting, I, you know, help anyone from that

all the way to, you know, getting connected with a holistic doctor or a dentist and that kind of

So all in all, I’m about essentially bringing the awareness

and really helping equip and empower women to know better

so that they can do better for themselves and their family.

JANNINE: So huge. We need it. We need more of us out there.

So keep up the good work. Thank you so much for coming on.

Autumn. I really appreciate it.

AUTUMN: Thanks so much for having me.

It’s been such a joy to share in these passions with you

with your incredible audience.

So God bless y’all.

JANNINE: Thank you.

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